Empirical Data

So. I decided to try something new, involving expanding the political game in a variety of different ways. At the moment, I'm feeling that it didn't work out. I added far too much, changed too much, without properly testing it, and as a result it's kind of a mess of stuff with no core purpose or vision. Ironically I recently told a man "start small, make sure you prototype" but apparently I don't listen to my own advice.

I like almost all the ideas in it. The characters now host balls and banquets, inviting their friends and allies. This would be excellent on the world map, as you could intercept them en-route, if you knew their plans, or deliberately lure the leaders of the society into a trap, or a ritual location to corrupt them all at once.

Crimes then can occur during these events, and the AI does some thinking about it, and can start rumours concerning whom they believe is responsible, then hold a trial and agree on sentencing. Sometimes they even get the right person.

Alongside this there's an improvement to how voting is imagined. It's now a constant conflict between various factions. Everyone has economic interests, and additional heirarchies exist, the Church and the Guild, who try to manipulate the aristocracy to their own ends.

Ignorance was also introduced, with the idea that you would need to discover people's relationships actively, to make knowledge a valued resource which you had to expend time and money to obtain. This was represented by Gossips. Some would be gained through talking to others, but you'd also need to find friendly faces near to your target to secure a full picture. As a result, spouses were briefly introduced, before being removed, which were possible avenues to reach hard-to-access characters.

To assist all this there are approximately an infinity of menus and minor actions you can take daily to subtly influence the goings on of the world.

However, when taken together, I don't really like it. I plan to take a break from this side, maybe work on the map a bit more, see about nonhuman factions and societies. I've uploaded the current state of this experimental branch, in case you want to take a look, or want to give your opinion on the state of things. It's "experimental_nonplayable_branch.zip" and comes with a small additional set of instructions to help you along your way.

Anyway, that's my report. Tried some stuff, didn't really work, will try other stuff to see if that works better.

Oh, and before I forget: I assume the answer is no, but is there any way to contact Josh, of "That Which Sleeps"? Last I heard even his own business partner couldn't reach him, so it seems unlikely, but if anyone happens to secretly know a way, I'd be interested in dropping him an E-mail to discuss some stuff.


experimental_nonplayable_branch.zip 13 MB
Aug 18, 2017

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Hi again, any news? In these days I'm playing Stellaris and I've found really interesting the Factions handling:


I think a gameplay around placing key agents in a faction and manipulate it to grow in power in the kingdom is really cool! Hope some news soon!

See for yourself: I've uploaded the work-in-progress version. Loads of stuff still to do before it's complete, but it's now playable. Massive changes from previous versions have lead to the removal of most features, but they'll be back, and better.

I'll have to re-install Stellaris to check these new mechanics out. Not played it for a few months, nor tried any of the DLC.

cool! I will check it ASAP :D

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Hi again, have you take a look to some Europa Universalis 4 diplomacy mechanics?


in particular


I think manipulating the attitude should be a good starting point for the design ?

Also take a look to Estates ( factions ):


Thanks for the links. I'll have to check them out. The game is partially based on Crusader Kings II, but I've not played EU4, so will have to read about how it does diplomacy. There's no shame in learning from the best, and I'm told EU4 is the best at what it does.

Don't worry too much about the results of this experiment. I'm keeping only a few bits of it, and working on a new direction. I'm prepared to accept it didn't work how I wanted, and my new approach is showing far more promise. I should have stuff to show in a couple of weeks at most. Already got some good stuff, but want a bit more before I do a post and maybe release an early playable version.

Cool, thanks!

I've tried your experiment and almost lost into it, because there are a lot of options and things to do! Don't be diverted by my report, because I found really hard to understand what your interface do and then of course the game can let me do.

As said before, I hope you can share some design ideas to get feedback before  doing it ?

About TWS, there are a lot information in the wiki, maybe can help/inspire you https://thatwhichsleeps.gamepedia.com/That_Which_Sleeps_Wiki

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I found the facebook page for the artist who did work for That Which Sleeps, you want me to ask them about getting in touch with Josh?

EDIT: Artist hasn't spoken to Josh for a while and doesn't have his contact info anymore.